quote:...In all seriousness, have you ever noticed that often actors/actresses win the Oscar for roles that may have not been his/her all-time best. I think of people like John Wayne and Paul Newman. I'm sure there are several examples if someone wanted to help me out.
You are right about Paul Newman. He finally won his Oscar for The Color Of Money, which wasn't bad, but far from being his best work. In Paul's case, he had been nominated (and lost) so many times before, I guess most Academy members felt he was overdue for one, so decided to vote for him after all these years.
In John Wayne's case, he made the kind of films that usually don't win Oscars. But I thought he did an agreeably good job --- even though it seemed a self-parody --- in True Grit. But you're right; The Duke had been nominated only once before, during the 40's. And the voters felt it was time to honor him an Oscar.
Steven Spielberg had been nominated several times for his directing movies, but they were usually escapist lightweight stuff (not that it's bad, mind you). I even remember a joke in a "MAD" magazine article during the 80's that said hell will probably freeze over when the 'Chicago Cubs win the World Series and Steven Spielberg wins an Academy Award'! But Spielberg directed the dead-serious Schindler's List, that finally won him his Oscar.
Elizabeth Taylor won her first Best Actress Oscar for Butterfield 8 mainly because she was gravely ill a month before the show, and the voters thought she would die, so they voted her in, out of sentimentality. Taylor later admitted that she thought the movie was awful, and only took the part to finish her MGM contract, because 20th Century Fox offered her a then-record $1 million contract to appear in Cleopatra (1963). Taylor did win (deservedly) another Oscar for her role in Who's Afraid Of Viriginia Woolf? six years later.
Al Pacino had been nominated seven times before, and lost, until he finally won for The Scent Of A Woman (1992). Some voters probably may have thought his performance was too hammy and over-the-top, but I guess they really wanted Pacino to win an Oscar after all these years of being passed over.
Michael Caine won a Supporting Acting award for Hannah And Her Sisters (1986), but I really don't think he deserved it. That award should've gone to Dennis Hopper in Hoosiers. But Caine had never won an Oscar before, so it seems the voters wanted to award him when they had the chance.
Rex Harrison's performance in My Fair Lady wasn't all that bad, but he been nominated only once before, so it appears the Academy members wanted to reward him for his long career, instead of his work in that movie, and I suspect that is how he got the Best Actor award. Rex also did the same role in the original Broadway stage version earlier.
So, it is not just about honoring the best work in their career. It is also about a lifetime achievement, or a way of making amends for past oversights.
I'm sure there are more examples, but that's all I can think of right now! Posted by ValleyCat (Member # 1322) on :
Excellent examples Steven. Every movie and acting performance is in the eye of the beholder, but lifetime achievement or getting mistakenly overlooked in the past definitely play a roll in winning an Oscar at times. I guess when you're dealing with such a subjective award it will always happen.
Posted by GremlinBreakfast (Member # 2585) on :
I can remember a lot of people debating whether Denzel Washington should have won the Academy Award for 'Training Day.' He has performed a lot better in other movies in my opinion!
The same goes for Dame Judi Dench, who won for eight minutes of 'Shakespeare In Love,' instead of her excellent performance in 'Mrs Brown.' Some have said she got the sympathy vote for not winning the time before.
In terms of movies, I can rememeber reading in the magazine 'Total Film' over here in the UK that 'Pulp Fiction' should have won the Oscar instead of 'Forrest Gump.'
A good topic this!
~grems!
[ 21. January 2005, 12:16: Message edited by: GremlinBreakfast ]
Posted by Chris Fulmer (Member # 3197) on :
Robin Williams's victory in Good Will Hunting seems to fall along these lines to me. Good Morning Vietnam best showcased his talents IMO. But then again, the Academy never has and probably never will seriously consider pure-blooded comedians for awards, going all the way back to when they turned aside Charlie Chaplin in the very first awards presentation. It's amazing they even considered Bill Murray last year, even though I'm sorry to say he's sliding slowly past his prime. I cringe to think how many great 80s comedy performances were tossed casually aside when voting time came (Murray defintiely deserved one for Venkman, and its the crime of the century they didn't nominate Christopher Lloyd for playing Doc Brown).
Posted by StevenHW (Member # 509) on :
Parts of Chris Fulmer's post:
quote:Robin Williams's victory in Good Will Hunting seems to fall along these lines to me. Good Morning Vietnam best showcased his talents IMO...
Quite agree! Not saying that Robin's performance in Good Will Hunting was bad, but I could understand why the Academy probably felt it was time to give him a "Best Supporting Actor" Oscar. He seems likable enough, and it was his most dramatic role up to that time.
Personally, I think the award should've gone to Burt Reynolds, who was also nominated for his understated role in Boogie Nights. But he fired his agent over that movie (Burt originally didn't want to do the movie). And when his very public divorce from Loni Anderson got ugly, I think it probably cost him votes.
quote:...But then again, the Academy never has and probably never will seriously consider pure-blooded comedians for awards, going all the way back to when they turned aside Charlie Chaplin in the very first awards presentation...
The Oscars have rarely awarded out-and-out comedy movies, performances or comedians, I think mainly because too many stuffy people think comedies are never to be taken seriously enough for award consideration.
Exceptions are: It Happened One Night The Apartment (though it had dramatic moments) Annie Hall (more sublime compared to Woody Allen's earlier films)
Mel Brooks winning a screenplay award for The Producers.
Walter Matthau won a Supporting Actor award for The Fortune Cookie.
quote:...I cringe to think how many great 80s comedy performances were tossed casually aside when voting time came (Murray defintiely deserved one for Venkman, and its the crime of the century they didn't nominate Christopher Lloyd for playing Doc Brown).
Much agreed. And I would also have included Steve Martin and John Candy's performance in Planes, Trains, And Automobiles.
There's an old saying: "Dying is easy; comedy is hard", which explains why comedy acting is so much harder than dramatic acting.
I guess that is why comedy actors can make the transition to serious drama far better than the other way around.
[ 21. January 2005, 14:30: Message edited by: StevenHW ]
Posted by Canyoudigit. (Member # 2703) on :
99% of them are given to the most popular rather than the best.
Awards meen very little to me, it's all pats on the backs to those who are "in" at the time.
The fact that foreign films never get a look in really grates.
Posted by Ronnie (Member # 465) on :
quote:Originally posted by GremlinBreakfast: I can remember a lot of people debating whether Denzel Washington should have won the Academy Award for 'Training Day.' He has performed a lot better in other movies in my opinion!
~grems!
..COULDN'T AGREE MORE
Posted by Kash (Member # 297) on :
Denzil Washington should have won years ago for ‘Malcolm X’ whilst Valley and I tirelessly continue the campaign for Cruise (no chance he’ll ever get anything other than a lifetime achievement award).
Scorcese may, at last, get the nod for ‘The Aviator; (unless the Popes on the board and still holds ‘The Last Temptation Of Christ’ against him).
I quite like Rex Harrison but that Oscar belonged to Anthony Quinn, nobody was better that year, and Quinn’s performance in ‘Zorba The Greek’ was truly outstanding (very underrated actor Tony Quinn was).
John Wayne did two good films in my opinion ‘Stage Coach’ and ‘The Cowboy’ whilst Paul Newman deserved to win years earlier.
Again, I like Tom Hanks, but Forrest Gump was one of the most infuriating movies I’ve ever seen, and to see it trounce the infinitely superior in way, shape and form ‘Pulp Fiction’ just confirmed the fact that Oscars do not mean all that much in the grand scheme of things (i.e. 11 years down the line, which movie reigns supreme and features on more top 10 lists: Forrest Gump, or Pulp Fiction?)
I await the nominations, though if you were betting people (which I know you're not )Jamie Foxx looks like a defiante winner this year.
Posted by The Wizard (Member # 533) on :
quote:It's amazing they even considered Bill Murray last year, even though I'm sorry to say he's sliding slowly past his prime. I cringe to think how many great 80s comedy performances were tossed casually aside when voting time came (Murray defintiely deserved one for Venkman, and its the crime of the century they didn't nominate Christopher Lloyd for playing Doc Brown). [/QB]
He was very good in "Lost in Translation" I thought.
Posted by stitch groover (Member # 2895) on :
Russel Crow's Oscar for Gladiator was really for The Insider the year before.
Posted by mamamiasweetpeaches (Member # 1715) on :
Marissa Tomei and Kim Bassinger.
Posted by Giancarlo (Member # 2774) on :
Well this is a really interesting topic;I love the Oscars and I never missed one in 16 years but i really think that most of them have been given to undeserved people or pictures. It's a shame that Glenn Close and Sigourney Weaver never got one, for example. And I'm thinking of Helen Hunt instead of Judi Dench in Mrs.Brown, Halle Berry instead of Nicole Kidman in Moulin Rouge,Gwyneth Paltrow instead of Cate Blanchett in Elizabeth,Marlee Matlin instead of Sigourney Weaver in Aliens,Titanic instead of L.A. confidential,A beautiful mind instead of Moulin Rouge and i can add to this list many others.And it's a shame that talentless people like Russell Crowe, Renee Zellwegger,Charlize Theron,Catherine Zeta Jones and Roberto Benigni have won.
Posted by stitch groover (Member # 2895) on :
Come on Giancarlo, you can't call some of the people talentless. Like I said in my earlier post, Russell Crow didn't deserve his Oscar for Gladiator, but he did deserve one for The Insider, and maybe even LA Confidential (I still haven't seen Beautiful Mind). Catherine Zeta Jones isn't just some blowin from the isles - she has proven herself over many years. Just watch her in The Darling Buds of May!
Posted by StevenHW (Member # 509) on :
Here is a good article about undeserving Oscar winners!
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)Jamie Foxx looks like a defiante winner this year.
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